Vengeance

Vengeance => public => Topic started by: Axecleaver on Jul 25, 2002, 02:25 PM

Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Axecleaver on Jul 25, 2002, 02:25 PM
In short, go thrust.

Here's the table I made to demonstrate the new resistances in 1.51d:

--
Additionally, all defensive armor table bonuses are now doubled in RvR, meaning everyone takes less damage if they are protected against that specific damage type.
--

I'm seeing a lot of people misinterpret this. Notice this says only the BONUSES are doubled. So if you have a PENALTY against an armor type, it gets twice as bad. If you have a BONUS against an armor type it is unchanged.

So, for example, (I wish real world examples were used in patch notes so people could figure out what everything meant) here's the way it'll play out for Albions, assuming vuln=15% bonus, low=5% and high=15% resistances (which is unknown at this point) and a melee hit for 100 damage:

Slash
Chain was: 85(-15)  will be 70(-30)
Scale was: 95(-5) will be 115(+15)
Leather was: 115(+15) will be 115(+15)
Reinf was: 100(0) will be 70(-30)

Crush
Chain was: 100(0) will be 80(-20)
Scale was: 115(+15) will be 70(-30)
Leather was: 100(0) will be 80(-20)
Reinf was: 110(+10) will be 115(+15)

Thrust
Chain was: 115(+15) will be 115(+15)
Scale was: 95(-5) will be 95(-5)
Leather was: 85(-15) will be 70(-30)
Reinf was: 95(-5) will be 90(-10)

Summary: Crush is terrible. Choose thrust to rock mids, slash to rock hibs. Thrust has less penalties against hibs than slash against mids, so thrust is the obvious Albion choice.

Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Nari on Jul 26, 2002, 08:02 PM
Figures...(now that i have a crush armsman...)
Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Gueuze on Jul 27, 2002, 02:40 PM
It could be worse...you could be a friar with exactly one melee damage type to choose from.
Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Axecleaver on Jul 29, 2002, 06:29 PM
Dammit.

So now we have this autotrain thing to worry about. If your class autotrains in a line, and you DIDN'T autotrain that line, the points will be forcibly deducted from your available pool ANYWAY.

So, for example, an armsman will be forced to spend 12 trains (77 points) in crush, thrust, and slash right off the bat. That's 144 wasted points in a specline you'll never use! Paladins lose 77 points to slash if they respec.

Waiting to see if they fix this... with this autotrain stuff in, it's painful to use the full respec unless you're truly gimpy... as opposed to just sucking a little bit.

This will be a problem for: all armsmen, paladins who don't slash, infiltrators who don't stealth (eh, forget that last one, what infil doesnt train stealth?), mercs who don't DW(I think)

Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Reinn on Jul 29, 2002, 08:46 PM
Hmmm, with all these gyrations, I am wondering if I even need a respec---gonna take a while for me to sort this out.  Slam still sounds nice though--but alas I need MORE points to divvy up.  Lots to think about for us Scouts with Camo, etc.  We have a lot on us--It is a pressure cooker!!  Someone help me carry around this 10 ton steel ball PLEASE!!!!!!
Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Belgarath on Jul 29, 2002, 10:53 PM
thats all cool in stuff my merc is slash (would like to be thrust) which is cool :) but the good thing is us casters don't need to worry about this stuff cuz if your like me a theurg we get ganked even before we even see it coming so just so you know that graph thing by axecleaver is pretty good its accuarate sumwhat.
Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Axecleaver on Jul 30, 2002, 12:59 PM
My recommendation to EVERYONE is to wait and see for a week or two after the patch. Wait for the early adopters to iron out problems. I will definitely be doing this.

Who knows, a split spec may actually be viable if the double armor resists go live.

Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Gueuze on Jul 30, 2002, 11:28 PM
If my math on this is right, then chain is 30% better than plate vs. crush, and 3% better than plate vs. slash (but 37% worse vs. thrust).
Title: New Armor/Weapon Types
Post by: Gueuze on Jul 31, 2002, 05:51 PM
Scratch that, they changed the tables already.

I assumed 15% bonus/reduction for the vulnerable/resist damage:

vs crush:  Chain has 22% advantage
vs slash:  Plate has 10% advantage
vs thrust: Plate has 33% advantage

So the question becomes...what kind of weapons do you get smacked with the most?  Most non-assassins out there now have hammers, and I'm sure they won't be replacing them immediately.